The Latest: Israel, the Speaker's Race, and the Primary

TOPICS DISCUSSED

  • The World Responds to the Attack in Israel

  • The Race for Speaker of the House

  • 2024 Presidential Candidate Updates

  • Outside of Politics: Fall Break

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EPISODE RESOURCES

TRANSCRIPT

Sarah [00:00:09] This is Sarah Stewart Holland.  

Beth [00:00:10] And this is Beth Silvers. Thank you for joining us for Pantsuit Politics.  

[00:00:14] Music interlude.  

[00:00:34] Hello, everyone. Thank you for joining us for a new episode of Pantsuit Politics, where we take a different approach to the news. Today, we are just going to process a big complex week of world and domestic news. We're going to talk a little bit more about what's happening in Israel and the response to the October 7th attack, we will discuss the small matter of needing a Speaker of the House of Representatives so that Congress can function at all. And then we'll talk a little bit about comings, goings, changes in the presidential primaries. Outside of Politics, we are going to share a little with you about our fall breaks.  

Sarah [00:01:09] This week has been a particularly great time to be a member in our premium community. We've been trying to use that space to continue to cover the terrorist attacks in Israel. I have been covering the updates on the situation on my show Good morning. And Beth has shared a refreshed primer on how we got to the situation on her show More to Say. We hope our premium content is always useful to you and this week is no exception. We'd love for you to join us there if you haven't already, and you can find more information about doing that in the show notes.  

Beth [00:01:34] Next up, we will discuss updates on Israel and Israel's response to the Hamas terrorist attack.  

[00:01:42] Music interlude.  

[00:01:42] We are recording on Thursday, October 12th in the morning as we sit down to record the latest news from Israel concerns the formation of a unity government. And I think that that's worth spending some time on. It's a reminder to me, one, that Israel's system is very different than the U.S. system, and that's something that we return to every time that we talk about Israel. So just the possibility of forming a unity government is really interesting to me. But secondly, I think it underscores the level of threat and the level of need created in Israel by this confluence of circumstances where you have Prime Minister Netanyahu embroiled in both personal scandal, political scandal, and now the concern that on his watch an attack like this was able to happen. And in the face of that, instead of taking advantage of the moment, an opposition leader said, I will stand with you and we will govern together so that all of the people we are calling up to serve in this moment have confidence in their leadership.  

Sarah [00:03:03] I did think it was interesting it took so long. It took a long time to negotiate this unity government agreement. I mean, a long time in the sort of perspective we have post 9/11 and the unity that surrounded the country when we were attacked on this scale. I think it speaks, like I said, the sort of constant, consistent criticism still flowing from Israelis towards Netanyahu that this unity government was formed, but that it took almost a week to reach some sort of agreement between the parties about what that unity government will look like because the terror from this attack does not erase the distrust that I'm sure this opposing party feels towards Netanyahu. He is slippery, and I don't think that's going to stop. I think he probably feels even more threatened because of this criticism, because of this act that will mark his tenure forever. And so I'm not surprised that the unity government was ultimately formed, but I am a little surprised it took so long.  

Beth [00:04:05] So as this unity government was formed, we keep hearing very strong statements from Netanyahu that the goal now is to eradicate Hamas. Now, I think that's an unrealistic goal, but I understand the sentiment to be Israel will hold nothing back as it goes into what looks increasingly to be a ground incursion into Gaza. And just for a reference, I think it's helpful to remember the entire Gaza Strip is about the size of Detroit, Michigan. We are talking about a very small area, again, where 2 million people are basically trapped and cannot go anywhere. And so when you think about the devastation that will accompany that, it's just horror after horror here in the wake of what happened on Saturday.  

Sarah [00:04:55] Yeah The suffering in the Gaza Strip right now I think is hard to contemplate because when you look at the photos, it's not that it's just a small place. It's that it's so dense. It's so, so dense. And I heard the most heartbreaking interview on NPR this morning where this Palestinian man was like, "We are human too. We are human too and we feel abandoned." Because they're just moving from place to place, hoping to find some place of safety. There's been multiple reports that previously during these attacks, the U.N. schools were considered safe, but those have also been hit in this last few days. And so there is just no safe place. There is no exit. There are discussions now between Egypt and the United States to set up some sort of exit for other nations, citizens, for other nationals. But that's no relief to the Palestinian people. And so this attack, unlike any they've experienced-- when you are shocking the people of the Gaza Strip, that speaks to something. That speaks to a real escalation, which again comes after the escalation, like we talked about with Kerry. The cruelty, the terror that came on October 7th was like nothing that the Israeli people had experienced before. And we're learning more and more about that. These kibbutz that they are now entering and finding people gunned down at bus stops, babies murdered, people kidnapped, it's just so heinous. And the suffering with the Israelis who have still family members that have been kidnapped. There are Americans that are still being held captive. It's so heinous.  

Beth [00:06:35] I've been thinking a lot about that sense of abandonment for the people of Gaza, which is very real in layers. And the most present layer right now is that they have been abandoned by Hamas, which is supposed to function as a political party running their government and decided instead to be a terrorist organization instead of a protector and a stability provider and caretaker, which is what governments are supposed to be on some basic fundamental human level. I've been thinking about that and about these images and the details that emerge of what Hamas terrorists did on Saturday and how you get to a place where you're capable of that just as a person. And all I can understand as we get these details about what they did so personally at total random on Saturday to just bring about as much destruction as possible is just a level of hatred that I don't know. I don't know what that would feel like in my body and mind to see someone as so heinous and so less than human that this would be justified to me.  

Sarah [00:07:51] How am I as a person who grew up with all the gifts of a modern American life, public school, medical care, electricity, running water, a sense of security and safety always, possibly comprehend what it would be like to grow up under constant threat, constant surveillance? And, look, that's true for many Israelis too. The sense of someone across the border wants me to cease to exist. They're close. They don't see me as human and they want me to cease to exist. I just think that's very difficult to comprehend if you've not lived it. But the truth is, that's a lot of human existence. That's why we lived in so much violence. It's not a unique space that humans occupy where they feel disdain and hatred and they want to eliminate-- not just harm, not just contain, not just fight back, eliminate other human beings. That's a new development in human history for the most part. And we are capable, as most of human history shows, of immense violence, immense cruelty, immense suffering when we're in that space.  

Beth [00:09:13] I can't even comprehend the experience of my Jewish friends here in the United States. I got so choked up yesterday reading about the meeting that President Biden had with Jewish leaders at the White House because it included one of those Jewish leaders saying it's not lost on us as we're here that during World War Two, when Jewish leaders requested a meeting with President Roosevelt, they were turned away from the White House. That opened the floodgates of emotion that I have kind of been containing through all of this for me, because I was just thinking about what it must be like to live here in America but still with all of the past in your body and to endure casual anti-Semitism everywhere all the time, that carries this sense that you actually have all the power in the world when during the Holocaust your people were turned away from the White House. Even as America was trying to fight a war to end some of that suffering. I mean, it has just all engulfed me this week in terms of like the lack of perspective that I'm able to have on what's unfolding here. The one thing I want to say before we move on from this not to center American politics, but we are going to turn to American politics. I really want to applaud the way that President Biden and his administration have responded to this event. There is no good way.  

Sarah [00:10:48] Yes. 

Beth [00:10:49] But he has been as clear and thoughtful and just devoted to it as I think a person can be. If you read the TikToks on how he has spent his time since he first was alerted to this happening on Saturday, it's impressive and it's diligent, and I think it's the best that we could ask from our commander in chief.  

Sarah [00:11:10] It reminds me of his approach to Ukraine from his visit forward. This is a man who is devoted and believes in American leadership in the world. And it is abundantly clear from how he behaves during these foreign policy crises. And, look, I can hear the chorus saying, "What about the withdrawal of Afghanistan?" And I would argue that you can see some of that same diligence. You might not agree with the decision making, you might not agree with the fallout-- and I imagine he learned an enormous amount from that moment early in his presidency. But it still just to me this devotion of what we do matters. We cannot stay here forever. You just see our impact on the world matters. Our decision making at every spot matters. From his focus on building relationships in Asia and Australia and Japan. Just all of it. You just see the enormity and the gravitas and the prioritization of our standing on the world stage.  

Beth [00:12:11] Well, and I'm not an expert in foreign policy, but the thread that I would use to connect the approaches to those events-- and you know I've been a critic about the withdrawal from Afghanistan. The thread that I see is his sense that American leadership matters in the world very much, that diplomacy is a top priority, everything you just said. Plus, he seems to have a real clarity that we are willing to be allies through our money and our technology and our know how, but that we are going to be very reluctant to put American lives on the ground and at risk in conflicts that are not primarily ours. And I think that reflects a long career of him looking for kind of where is the public on this. And I think that is kind of where the public might coalesce if we all had to sit down and have a serious conversation about our approach to these things. I think most people believe, yes, America has a role to play in the world and we are tired of sending our people everywhere. And we have seen that sending our people everywhere has a lot of risk and consequence for us too. So we're going to take a quick break and come back and turn to the American political system, that tiny matter that we still need a speaker of the House and some updates on our presidential primary as well.  

[00:13:38] Music interlude.  

[00:13:58] Sarah, how do you think Steve Scalise is feeling as we're recording this Thursday morning?  

Sarah [00:14:05] I don't know Steve Scalise I don't think we'd be fast friends. But if I was Steve Scalise, I would think, I took a bullet for you freaking people and I can't get more than a bare majority in the behind the scenes vote? How the hell am I going to cinch the speaker on the floor? That's what I would think.  

Beth [00:14:21] So the Republican conference in a closed door meeting-- I would like to compliment the Republican Conference for a second. I like that they took everybody's cell phones as they went into this closed door meeting. I am for more places where we take everyone's cell phones. I just think we're at a place in human history where we have to realize this is not about your personal maturity. It is about the fact that these are addictive devices that steal our attention away from the matters in front of us. So I love that they took everybody's cell phones. So the Republican conference met without their cell phones. They hashed it out. They heard from speakers.  

Sarah [00:14:51] I like that you're like, no dress codes, but I am going to take your cell phone.  

Beth [00:14:53] Yes, that's how I feel about it. You be you, I am for your individuality and personal expression. But I am tired of our attention being stolen from us.  

Sarah [00:15:02] And I'm going to need that cell phone.  

Beth [00:15:05] So they meet and they vote. And Steve Scalise prevails over Jim Jordan in the vote.  

Sarah [00:15:12] Just barely.  

Beth [00:15:12] But just barely and not anywhere close to the number of votes that he needs to get elected speaker on the House floor. And so Republicans have not put that vote to the House floor yet. Patrick McHenry is still in the interim speakership role where he can do nothing except bring them back to vote on a new speaker. And I just think it cannot be stressed enough that means the House of Representatives cannot do anything, nothing, right now with government funding coming up, with the situation in Israel, with the situation in Ukraine, with the situation that we got a lot of important foreign policy things happening and a ton of ambassadors that need to be confirmed and a ton of military promotions that have been held up forever by Tommy Tuberville. I stopped myself from inserting an adjective in front of that. So it is a mess. They have got to get somebody in that post so that Congress can even do the bare minimum.  

Sarah [00:16:19] I mean, they weren't doing a lot before. Just for the record.  

Beth [00:16:23] They could do something. They could do a thing. 

Sarah [00:16:24] I think my expectations are so low with this lot who wants to pretend that Joe Biden should do what they want and that he is not the president and that he's not a Democrat. That's definitely some of their negotiating when it came to the funding and the budget. It's like, but we want this and we don't care that there's a Democratic Senate and a Democratic president. Let's just pretend that y'all aren't there, which is an interesting legislative strategy. So in case you thought I was being hyperbolic, Steve Scalise literally did take a bullet during a mass shooting at a congressional baseball game. He's also currently being treated.  

Beth [00:16:53] He has blood cancer right now.  

Sarah [00:16:54] Blood cancer?  

Beth [00:16:55] Yes.  

Sarah [00:16:55] I just want to be like, Steve, is this what you want to do? Is this what you want to do with your one wild and precious life? I felt the same way about Kelvin McCarthy. I don't like either of these men. But I guess somebody's got to do it. It is concerning the Freedom Caucus just keeps growing more powerful. And I think I do wonder. I wonder, is that it? Are they growing more powerful or is there just a lack of real leadership coming from the "Republican establishment"? Like, could the right person gather this group together? But I don't know if that's true. I don't know if it's like a lack of leadership under the Republican establishment. I mean, Steve Scalise claims he's going to be like a uniter, but he barely [inaudible]. It's like the territories are voting. They don't even vote on the floor like in this caucus meeting. So I don't know. I think that the Freedom Caucus has gotten a taste of power. It's not just the Freedom Caucus. I think we talk about the Freedom Caucus, especially when you're talking about Jim Jordan who ran against Steve Scalise, and you think back to the Tea Party. But the truth is, it's not just that their power has grown, their numbers have grown and their thirst for chaos and their devotion to Donald Trump-- Donald Trump's own power within the party just continues to grow. Nobody's touching him in the primary. It's just a very depressing state of the Republican Party, which is not a party I have a lot of warm feelings about. I've been a Democrat since I was 18 years old. I've said this before, it's a weird spot to have spent most of your adult life being like, I wish everybody could just see them for how bankrupt and inept they are. And now they're bankrupt and inept. And I'm like, oh man, this is sad to watch. It's weird. It's a weird place I'm in.  

Beth [00:18:40] I was reading this Politico piece about Paul Ryan and Mitt Romney convening lots of wealthy Republican donors to try to get people to coalesce around someone who's not named Donald Trump in the Republican primary, and Godspeed on that journey. I'm for it. It was interesting to me that Paul Ryan was quoted in this piece as partially diagnosing the affliction of the Republican Party as being built around a cult of personality. And I thought there's something true in that. If I think about the fragmentation of Democrats, it is ideological fragmentation. There are true groups that view what the policy should be in response to the world differently in the Democratic Party. And on the Republican side, what made me think about this is you saying the Freedom Caucus. I'm not even sure what the ideological commitment needs to be to be a part of the Freedom Caucus anymore. When the group of people who ousted Kevin McCarthy is in a place that doesn't include Thomas Massie, in a place that didn't even include Jim Jordan. Jim Jordan spoke for McCarthy. Jim Jordan has now offered to speak for Steve Scalise. Something entirely different is going on. And I think that the cult of personality is the genesis of that. But the problem is the cult of personality became so successful that now everybody wants to replicate their own version of it. And that's unmanageable because there is nothing to coalesce around except me, me, me. So you see this in things like what Matt Gaetz does. You see it in how Nancy Mace is trying a new strategy every day to keep herself in the news. That's about Nancy Mace, not about a principal and not about South Carolina voters. Everybody now wants to have whatever percentage they can carve off who will be with them no matter what, because it's them, not because of an idea that they're carrying forward.  

Sarah [00:20:40] I guess it's like the MAGA caucus. It is that complete inability to actually follow leadership. Jim Jordan said, "I'll support Scalise." And half the people that voted for him said, "I don't think so." It would be interesting to get like Mitch McConnell and Nancy Pelosi in a room and say, "Hey, what's going on with these Republicans who won't follow any sort of party leadership?" What do you think happened? What's broken inside of them? Is it just Donald Trump and that style of politics that is successful inside the Republican base is a complete and total disregard for any sort of hierarchy, like the breaking of the rules is the point? Is that what it is? Is like that's the politics. That's what we're devoted to. Because like you said, there's no policy disagreement. There's no anything like that with Steve Scalise. I don't even know why Marjorie Taylor Greene, who was very devoted to Kevin McCarthy, won't vote for Steve Scalise. Why? Like, how come? I don't understand. So I think you're right. I don't think it's definitely not policy. And I do think it is new to see so many party representatives just refuse to follow any party leadership. Maybe that's it. Maybe they feel no real loyalty to the Republican Party because they're following Donald Trump. And guess who else feels no loyalty to the Republican Party? Donald Trump.  

Beth [00:22:07] They don't feel loyalty to Donald Trump anymore. Donald Trump told them how to make Jim Jordan the speaker and he [inaudible] nominated. So the cult of personality has broken to some extent, but instead of breaking like a fever where we go back to the old way, it has spawned this new approach, I think, that is not party first, it's not Trump first, it's just me first. How many of us can be me first?  

Sarah [00:22:32] It's so interesting, though, because there seems to be some sort of organization among this group. I don't know. I mean, you have like Chip Roy, who does seem to have like demands, I guess. But Matt Gaetz is supporting Steve Scalise. I don't understand it. I really don't understand it, except for I think that they don't want there to be a federal government, which is an interesting position to be in as a House of representative member. I don't know. I mean, I think the best term is probably the Chaos Caucus. But because that's what you get when everybody's just out for themselves.  

Beth [00:23:05] I thought it was true to hear Don Bacon say, apparently these folks want to be in the minority. I think that's right. I think that's what they want to be.  

Sarah [00:23:15] I actually did think that I'm like, oh, they just want to be a permanent, loud minority. That's what they want. They want to just gum up the works without ever actually leading.  

Beth [00:23:25] And you know what? Better for America. Let's do it. Just be the minority. I think that's great. This is the moment-- you remember how Jon Stewart used to be like, "Meet me at camera three," when he was doing The Daily Show? I wish that I had like a similar, I don't know, "Meet me at Speaker three to the problem solvers caucus." This is the moment then to say, "Fine, you got to be in the minority? Cool." We're going to work with the Democrats and we'll elect speaker of the House. And you can be angry and fundraise and go on podcast and sound off on it all you want to, but we're going to be over here now governing.  

Sarah [00:23:56] Yeah.  

Beth [00:23:57] The numbers are available to do it. I wish that the people who are inclined to think responsibly at all would be as bold in their pursuit of responsible governance as their colleagues are in their pursuit of chaos. That's all it would require.  

Sarah [00:24:15] I don't know. You just got to be careful because then you get more and more members of the problem solving caucus or just more and more members who aren't lunatics. I don't mean to be ugly, but lunatics. Getting primaried and then you just got more lunatics. So it is a lot and you got to walk.  

Beth [00:24:32] Yeah. I also think, though, that we have seen the same strategy for a number of years now about walking that line and it isn't working.  

Sarah [00:24:40] But isn't it because the caucus is growing. The Chaos Caucus is growing. So isn't it working?  

Beth [00:24:46] That is my definition of it's not working. That the chaos caucus is growing, that trying to walk the line of establishment chaotic Trump base has only proliferated the unmanaged ability of the situation.  

Sarah [00:25:02] That's true. Well, to me, honestly, and I don't know if this is realistic because when you you have this sort of capture of the state parties where Mitt Romney's getting booed at their conferences, because the truth is it will take movement from state leadership to say, we're going to draw the lines different. We can't have any more this. It's too much. But what's the investment of a state speaker of the House and the malfunctioning of a House of Representative Republican Caucus? I don't know. I don't think that it's there. That's how you get a Rusty Bowers standing up before the January six committee and saying enough is enough. But then he lost, so I don't know. I mean, because the primary isn't just about the policies or the leadership or the Republican establishment in the House of Representatives. The primary is also about the decisions made by the state party leadership that has been mostly captured by this chaotic caucus. So I think that's the real problem.  

Beth [00:26:11] Just figuring out the real problem is a challenge because there are so many problems here. Well, let's talk about the presidential election for a minute. We've had some developments. I don't know how consequential any of them are, but they are developments. Thing number one, Robert F Kennedy Jr has decided not to run as a Democrat. In fact, he will mount an independent bid for the presidency.  

Sarah [00:26:33] It sounds great. Trump's big mad because he polls and hurts Trump more, which I think sounds right to me. That sounds right to me. When somebody is like he hurts Trump more than he hurts Biden, I go, "Yeah, that tracks."  

Beth [00:26:44] My favorite detail of this is that he had already been invited to talk at CPAC and accepted the invitation. And now everybody in Republican world is big mad at him because they wanted him to come as a Democrat to trash Democrats at CPAC. So this is going to be very fascinating to watch. There are lots of little skirmishes that are going to be brought up by this that I think will be entertaining.  

Sarah [00:27:04] And also his siblings all put out a statement that were like, don't do it. He's lost the plot.  

Beth [00:27:10] Yeah.  

Sarah [00:27:11] When your siblings come out against you-- was that Andy Biggs in Arizona that his siblings came out? I just can't imagine what that's like, especially in a family like the Kennedys. It's not like your just like siblings that grew up in middle America. Your siblings that have survived so much trauma and tragedy together. And you have to be like, that's enough, dude. That's hard.  

Beth [00:27:32] It is hard. I keep looking at the speaker situation and thinking, this is so embarrassing. That is the overwhelming word that comes to me when I watch this. But then I think a lot of those people aren't embarrassed. They're not capable of embarrassment. That's just not a thing for them anymore. The Kennedys, though, this is embarrassing. And I think that probably sinks in a deep and complex way that I can't fully appreciate. Okay. We also have a new entrant to the Democratic primary. Cenk Uygur of the Young Turks has said that he is going to run for president. Small problem. He is not constitutionally eligible to run for president, but nevertheless, he says that he is entering the field.  

Sarah [00:28:16] I don't understand that. I mean, he'd have to get a ruling from the Supreme Court. Does it strike you as the Supreme Court that's going to be friendly to this type of argument?  

Beth [00:28:23] It does not.  

Sarah [00:28:24] The Young Turks aren't my cup of tea. I don't know how to say it any nicer.  

Beth [00:28:27] I think that's a good summary. Okay. Also on the Republican side, Will Hurd has officially dropped his bid for the nomination and endorsed Nikki Haley.  

Sarah [00:28:39] I mean, it just seems to me post two debates, Nikki Haley is the one to watch. I don't think she's going to beat Donald Trump. But it does seem to be the coalescing that's happening. Maybe Tim Scott right behind her. Did you see that statement he put out about Israel?  

Beth [00:28:57] I have tried so hard to be gracious about Tim Scott and I will just not speak about him anymore, because I think that is so reprehensible. So reprehensible to blame Joe Biden for what happened in Israel.  

Sarah [00:29:11] For a terrorist attack. Get out of here.  

Beth [00:29:13] I don't know if that is more ignorance or cynicism, but whatever combination of the two produced that is despicable to me. From a sitting United States senator, no.  

Sarah [00:29:27] I will say this. I don't think there's a lot of love lost between Nikki Haley and Tim Scott. And I bet you at the next primary debate she brings that up.  

Beth [00:29:34] I bet she does. I bet she does. And I bet it will land because she can land a punch. That's what she's done.  

Sarah [00:29:41] [Inaudible] foreign policy. She's done really good about that.  

Beth [00:29:43] And, look, I think this is another testament to the fact that Will Hurd is a reasonable, logical person who cares about the country. He dropped out because he didn't make the first two debates, sees the writing on the wall, sees that Nikki is the person to beat and is probably trying to do a Pete Buttigieg here. Gracefully bow out quickly so that everybody else will follow, so that there's some chance of everybody coming together behind her to take on Trump one on one. That is what needs to happen. And the problem is, I don't think the rest of the field is as principled as Will Hurd is.  

Sarah [00:30:20] No, I don't think that's going to happen. I would like to believe that the lack of seriousness surrounding Russia's invasion of Ukraine and the Hamas terrorist attack on Israel, and as we previously discussed, President Biden's really impeccable handling of both of these situations, particularly in contrast to Donald Trump's recent statements praising Hezbollah, which was a real choice, that sense that the world is in trouble. And you know what really upsets me is it's just some of this sort of feels like, wow, things have gotten really bad and I want to be like, boy, I wonder if any of it is related to the dramatic turn Donald Trump took our foreign policy on. Like, some of this is like the natural consequences when the American president stands up and says if the bad guys are in charge, what's the big deal? I hope all that contrast is so plain for people that even Republican voters-- I know this is a long shot. Even the Republican base would look for someone with more gravitas on the world stage. But I know, as I say those words, that's not going to happen. But sometimes I just try to manifest as best I can.  

Beth [00:31:29] I think Republican voters want that. I don't know that the Republican primary voter wants it. This is the problem. Every time I think, well, here's what would make sense given what's happened. I run into a structural barrier. And the structural barrier in this whole presidential cycle is just that our primaries are inadequate to represent the will of the people who are going to turn out to vote in the general election. And other than asking lots more people to vote in those primaries, I don't know what to do about it. 

Sarah [00:32:09] That's what I keep thinking. Maybe it's just time for people to go back to the Republican Party and try to save its from itself.  

Beth [00:32:13] I think that's right. I mean, that's my plan. I think voting in the Republican primary is the thing to do this time.  

Sarah [00:32:21] Yeah. During the almost government shutdown, [inaudible] he's like, you want me leave or you want me stay so I can vote in the primary. And we're like, JK, you stay.  

Beth [00:32:30] That's [inaudible].  

Sarah [00:32:31] JK stay.  

Beth [00:32:33] We will continue, I'm sure, to visit with the presidential primary now and then we will certainly continue to watch what happens in the speaker's race. And, of course, our hearts and minds are with everyone who is suffering as a result of Hamas's actions on October 7th and everything that will follow. We always try to end the show with what's on our minds Outside of Politics. So that's up next. 

[00:32:58] Music interlude.  

[00:33:16] Sarah, rudely my school district has a much shorter fall break than yours does.  

Sarah [00:33:20] I don't know why doesn't love you? I wanted to love you. I wanted to care for you. I want you to have a full week for Fall break. I didn't even have a full week. I had a full week and then the Monday after, because it was Indigenous Peoples Day. So we were on fall break for, like, 10 days. And you had to run to California and back in like three. It's just unacceptable. I'm going to put myself on your calendar committee.  

Beth [00:33:37] My school district does a lot of things really, really well. But the calendar is not one of them. So we were off Friday and Monday. But you were gone the whole week before, enjoying lovely national parks in California. Why don't you tell us about it?  

Sarah [00:33:52] Yeah, we went to Yosemite. One of our listeners commented, "Yosemite was the first national park I visited." And I was like, oh, no, don't do that, guys. Don't make this the first one you go to. It will ruin you for all other national parks. It is maybe the most beautiful place I have ever been. And I've been to almost half the national parks and almost all of Europe and parts of Africa. I've been to a lot of places is what I'm trying to say. Yosemite is spectacular, just spectacular. And we were really lucky because so much of Yosemite is the waterfalls. Usually the waterfalls are done running by like August. It was raining the first few days we were there. And I think some of this is like the snow pack from the massive storms they had in the winter and they were all running. And it's just such a magical place. The beauty, the landscaping is nothing short of magical. We haven't been to Yellowstone yet, but you know why Yosemite I think is like the second national park? They got there and they were like, oh, this place, this place needs protecting. I can't say enough. And we stayed in the Yosemite Valley Lodge, so we were on the floor, so we weren't driving in and out every day. It wasn't crowded. The weather was beautiful. We loved it. Cannot recommend Yosemite highly enough. And that's like when I said like, I'll read Barbara Kingsolver. Well, yeah, duh. I know it's like the gem of the National Park system, but it's incredible.  

Beth [00:35:20] When you say the weather was lovely, what kind of temperatures are we talking about?  

Sarah [00:35:23] You know what kind of temperatures I'm talking about, Beth. 48 degrees. Peak temp. It's a little chilly. It's just a little chilly. So you can hike and keep your coat on. And it was great. It was like cool. It rained like it rained maybe the first few days on and off, but it was sunny a lot of the time because the El cap, it was so good. Have you ever seen free solo about the guy who climbed El Cap with no ropes?  

Beth [00:35:44] I have not.  

Sarah [00:35:45] You should see it. We watched it our last day in L.A., because Nicholas has seen it like four times. He's obsessed with it. El Cap is like 3000 feet high. It's the beast. Like, when you're in the car, you're, like, ducking. You have to kind of, like, stick yourself under the windshield and the dashboard just to see the top. It's so tall. And he climbed it without ropes. It's insane. You should watch with your girls. We watched it with all the boys. It's so, so fun to watch. I mean, tell everybody up front he lived. And still doesn't even matter. You're still like a nervous wreck, but it's so good.  

Beth [00:36:16] So you drove to San Francisco and flew to Southern California?  

Sarah [00:36:21] No, we didn't drive to San Francisco. We flew to San Francisco. And then we drove to Yosemite. We drove to Kings Canyon. Kings Canyon was about half shut down. We didn't see a lot there because of the snow. Man, they had pictures of the visitors center. I guess it was the visitor center or not, I couldn't really tell. Then we did Sequoia, which are the trees. The trees are more than trees. The trees are like tree gods. That's what it feels like when you're standing under a tree like that. Like any moment it could like lift of its feet and sort of walk off. And then we went to Pinnacles, kind of squeezed in Pinnacles, which was hot. It was not like Yosemite, it was like 90 degrees. But they have caves that are made from falling boulders. It's like a specific kind of cave. There are bats. It was very cool. And then we flew to Los Angeles to meet up with the Silver family so that we could go see Chelsea Devantez's live show on Friday night.  

Beth [00:37:10] Yeah, my children were in school until the end of the day on Thursday. So Friday morning we took an early flight out, which meant that we arrived in Los Angeles at about 9 a.m. there, so we'd been up for many hours by the time we sat down to have breakfast. But that's what we did. We had breakfast, we drove to Santa Monica, we drove through Malibu, we went to Griffith Observatory so that Ellen could have a photoshoot with the Hollywood sign, which was extremely important to her. And then we met you all and went to Chelsea's show, which was very fun.. We did encounter the problem that one encounters in L.A., which is that you think that you're 20 minutes from somewhere and you're more like an hour from that place. So we were a little late for Chelsea, but it was wonderful to see her.  

Sarah [00:37:55] Yeah, there was no y'all. It was just me because Nicholas didn't get to come because our flight was at like, five. I should have known better. I knew the second I booked that flight, this is going to be tight. And between picking up the rental car and taking the kids back to the Airbnb, he missed it. Which is sad because he really, really loves Chelsea. But it was so fun to see her show. It was like Cher theme. There's a drag queen. There was a PowerPoint presentation about Cher's multiple rebranding, and was very fun.  

Beth [00:38:22] Everyone was dressed up, which we're always here for. If you don't know Chelsea, she is the host of the Glamorous Trash podcast. She's a TV writer. She's been on our show a couple of times, most recently talking about the writers strike and just the dearest. She is so funny and warm and gracious and wonderful. And so we went and saw her again. The next day she had an event that we attended, and then we spent some time with Caroline Edwards, who is our beloved podcast agent who is out on parental leave right now. So we got to meet her new baby and have tea at her house, which was the best.  

Sarah [00:38:54] I love babies. You really shouldn't let me come visit your newborn because I might steal them. I love a newborn. I sent Caroline a screenshot of my Oura heart rate and it literally, like, just dipped every time I was holding the baby. It's like a meditation. Oh, I love holding a newborn. It's the best.  

Beth [00:39:12] That was fun. We went to an event with them that evening, and then the next day, Chad and I took the girls to Disneyland.  

Sarah [00:39:21] I loved how you were on Instagram like because we don't value rest. Because your kids have been at Universal that day. Our husbands and children went to Universal while we were hanging out with Chelsea and Caroline, and then you got up early and went to Disneyland, which while not Disney World, is still a Disney theme park.  

Beth [00:39:36] It's not a relaxing day.  

Sarah [00:39:38] Not a relaxing day. No, no, no.  

Beth [00:39:40] We had a very good time.  

Sarah [00:39:41] And then you took the red eye back.  

Beth [00:39:44] Correct.  

Sarah [00:39:45] You haven't told me how that went.  

Beth [00:39:47] Well, my thought was we'll just wear ourselves out and drive to the airport and get on a plane and come home. And that was true. We were very tired. It was very hot. We did DNS and Disneyland. We hit everything that we could hit. It was pretty easy. I mean, it's so much smaller than the parks in Florida that you can do a lot and in a relatively short amount of time, especially because we have recently been to the parks in Florida. So we were just focused on what's new here, what's different, or what do we really love that we want to be sure that we do? And so we got through all of that. It was really fun. And the reason that we're willing to do it is I just think they're at the peak ages for this right now. They so enjoy it. We have such a good time as a family when we do amusement parks right now, so we did it. And then we got on the red eye. And you know what? I cannot be mad because everything was on time. We had no airline difficulty whatsoever. And that is the grace that I will accept. Also, though, I do not recommend the red. I would not do it again if I could avoid it. I'm glad that we did and got home and were able to like come home, go to bed, get some laundry done before they had to go to school the next day. But we're all still dragging a little bit.  

Sarah [00:41:02] Did anybody sleep?  

Beth [00:41:04] I think I slept on and off most of the flights. Ellen came in and out. Jane and Chad, I believe, stayed awake the whole time.  

Sarah [00:41:14] The last time I took a red eye was when we met in Las Vegas. And I was making it back for a funeral of a beloved church member. That may be the only time I've ever taken-- I think Nicholas I took a red eye like15 years ago on the way back from Hawaii. And I remember getting sick. The problem with the red eye from the West Coast is it's not long enough. It's not like when you fly to Europe and you have 7 to 9 hours to sleep. It's just not long enough. So when I flew back from Vegas and I got the big seat on JetBlue or whatever, and I slept, but it's still like 3 hours. It's not long enough. It's maybe 4 hours between takeoff and landing. It's just not enough time.  

Beth [00:41:50] I totally agree. I would do it again if it were just me and Chad. I would not ask the kids to do that again. I think it was way too much for the kids. But the biggest problem for me is that the last ride we rode before we left Disneyland was Matador, the oldest roller coaster. And if you've not done this ride, it's a bobsled going around a mountain. And you get in the bobsled and your body is positioned as though you're going to have a pap smear. Okay? That's how you're sitting for the whole ride. And it's an old coaster and it is jolty. Like it just beats your joints up. And so we get off that after this day of lots and lots of walking in the heat, then we get in the car and drive to LAX and then on the plane. And so my body has just felt crunchy since we got home.  

Sarah [00:42:34] Yeah, it's rough. We just took a 3 p.m. flight. I highly recommend that. It was much better. California treated us so incredibly kindly. I've come around to remembering and realizing that I spent like a fourth of my childhood in California. And so it is not my home state, but my home away from home state. And I really just soaked up the love and affection I have for the state of California on this trip. I'm getting a little choked up. And it might be because my dad is moving from California to Kentucky, and so there's a lot tied up there. But I was just like, man, this is such a beautiful, beautiful place that holds so many-- I mean, it has like eight dang national parks. Like, it's an incredible state and it's like every other state that becomes sort of a political stereotype, you miss so much when you treat it like that. And the Californians were so happy I was there and they were in my dreams and they love this place. And I felt the love. And we had a really, really wonderful time in California.  

Beth [00:43:39] Yeah, every state has its challenges, but for all those challenges, California is visually stunning, naturally spectacular. The people are extremely friendly. And I think it is a good time. And I'm also glad to be home.  

Sarah [00:43:53] And really even Los Angeles in the traffic we had a good debate about whose [inaudible] is better than New York and L.A. Hit us up in the comments. I want to hear y'all's thoughts on that. I have some thoughts on that. I won't share right now just so I don't explode this conversation as we're trying to wrap it up. But even the traffic in L.A., as long as you're not trying to go anywhere at nighttime or you find some other way to get there and get back, it's really not so bad. I drove most of the time we were there. And again during the day, it was fun.  

Beth [00:44:19] I think the most difficult thing about the trip was that the Hamas attack occurred while we were there and just trying to hold all those pieces at one time and be in touch with the people that we need to be in touch with and think through what our obligations to this community were, that is all. I still feel with my crunchiness in my body too. So I'm grateful that the weekend is coming up and I hope that all of you are able to find some ease and support over the weekend as well. Thank you so much for being here. We'll be back in your ears on Tuesday. Just a quick reminder that we are will be in Paducah next week and there are still a few tickets available for the live show on Saturday, October 21st. So if you've been on the fence, come off the fence and come meet us in Paducah. It's going to be so much fun. Everybody, have the best weekend available to you.  

[00:45:06] Music interlude  

Sarah: Pantsuit Politics is produced by Studio D Podcast Production. 

Beth: Alise Napp is our managing director. Maggie Penton is our director of Community Engagement. Sarah: Xander Singh is the composer of our theme music with inspiration from original work by Dante Lima. 

Beth: Our show is listener-supported. Special thanks to our executive producers. 

Executive Producers: Martha Bronitsky. Ali Edwards. Janice Elliott. Sarah Greenup. Julie Haller. Tiffany Hasler. Emily Holladay. Katie Johnson. Katina Zuganelis Kasling. Barry Kaufman. Molly Kohrs. Katherine Vollmer. Laurie LaDow. Lily McClure. Linda Daniel. Emily Neesley. The Pentons. Tracey Puthoff. Sarah Ralph. Jeremy Sequoia. Katie Stigers. Karin True. Onica Ulveling. Nick and Alysa Villeli. Amy Whited. Emily Helen Olson. Lee Chaix McDonough. Morgan McHugh. Jen Ross. Sabrina Drago. Becca Dorval. Christina Quartararo. The Lebo Family. 

Sarah: Jeff Davis. Melinda Johnston. Michelle Wood. Joshua Allen. Nichole Berklas. Paula Bremer and Tim Miller. 

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