Commemorating Endings (with Sara Sterley)
For everything there is a season... Today, we talk to Sara Sterley (aka Sara By the Season) about endings, living seasonally, and how 2020 has shaped us. Plus, we share an important announcement of our own.
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Transcript:
Sarah: [00:00:00] Hi, I'm Sarah.
Beth: [00:00:05] And I'm Beth.
Sarah: [00:00:06] We host a Pantsuit Politics, a podcast with a remarkable community of listeners.
Beth: [00:00:10] Here on The Nuanced Life, we come together every week to answer your questions and commemorate your milestones and hopes of bringing a little more grace to every aspect of life.
Hello everyone. Thank you for joining us for this episode of the nuanced life. We have a very special guest with us today. Sara Sterley, better known as Sara by the Season, who has joined us before and has become such a good friend and really like counselor to us about living seasonally. And Sarah is a perfect guest to join us today because we are making a seasonal change in the life of our work together.
Sarah, do you want to share our news?
Sarah: [00:00:53] Yes. We have decided to end the Nuanced Life and this will be the last episode. [00:01:00] The season in which we started the Nuanced Life is very different than the season in which we currently find ourselves. As we start new adventures and shift some of our business around, we felt like it was just the right time to bring the Nuanced Life to a close.
Now that doesn't mean that we're going to stop commemorating. It doesn't mean that this content is all going to disappear. It doesn't mean that we will stop celebrating with you or grieving with you or sharing our thoughts on living nuanced and all the ways, either on Pantsuit Politics or social media, but we're going to give ourselves the freedom to explore that a little differently in 2021 and stop producing the weekly episode of the Nuanced Life.
And so we are just so grateful that Sara came here to talk with us about all the seasons that we're currently experiencing. I told her, I feel like we're in this sort of liminal space between wrapping up 2020, the calendar year, but also knowing that we [00:02:00] have a couple of difficult winter months coming in 2021, and then we kind of just sprung it on her that she was helping us close out the season of the Nuanced Life.
We're so grateful that she's, she's up for the challenge here to talk with us and guide us about living seasonally. Thank you so much for coming, Sarah,
Sara Sterley: [00:02:15] Thank you both for having me so much and just thank you for the Nuanced Life and what that has meant to all of us listeners and especially the idea of celebrating all things big and small, and really that there are no small things. So just so appreciate that from you and I'm grateful to be here.
Sarah: [00:02:33] Well, and the wisdom you always bring is like part of celebrating something and understanding its importance, is really understanding that everything is not forever and I think that's like such good wisdom.
Sara Sterley: [00:02:45] I think too, it's living this way is obviously helpful, you know, for the winter or spring, whatever season we find ourselves in, but it also shows us that everything has a season.
And so the Nuanced Life had a season and we need to be better at [00:03:00] and doing things well, uh, we don't do that well, I think especially as Americans and just kind of wait until like burnout happens or something, instead of kind of seeing the writing on the wall, or even not the writing on the wall, just saying this isn't a sustainable for the long haul and this is a good, a good time to end kind of thing.
So, and just like to your point, Sarah, that also helps like with raising families, you know, that there's a season of, you know, the baby where you're in the thick of it and you're just treading water. But that, that has an end. We're kind of, we have an 11 and eight year old right now. So I keep saying, we're just like in this really fun season where there's, they're really interesting people, but they still want to hang out with us a lot because they have no choice right now, obviously, but it's a really fun season.
And so that not in like a clinging to it too tightly standpoint, but saying that out loud and naming, it helps me to just be more grateful for it in the moment and remind myself to be in the moment.
Beth: [00:03:56] Sarah, for people who have not heard your voice before, [00:04:00] will you just briefly tell us how you came to be an expert on seasons and how you express that expertise?
Sara Sterley: [00:04:07] So I kind of backed into it. I'm a like hardcore tree hugger. And so I started just seeing the way that food impacted the environment. And we do, we eat three times a day. And so I started just being conscientious about where my food came from and growing some of our own. And then that just kind of snowballed into so many aspects of our lives, but we've been living this way, I would say for close to 15 years now.
So it's not like overnight. I mean, just like nature moves incrementally, we've moved incrementally too. And I think that, that when you, if you want to, to start trying to live more in tune with kind of nature's rhythms, then that's a great place to start, is just like pick one small thing and not feeling like, like, even when I talk about this, it's over the course of more than a decade of practicing all this stuff, [00:05:00] making a lot of mistakes along the way.
And the freedom of living seasonally is that, you know, there are some seasons where I can be more you know, diligent in the garden or the kitchen or whatever. And there are just seasons where that doesn't happen. Um, but this just helps you, there's more freedom in living that way, cause you know, there's other seasons around the corner where maybe, you know, you have the energy to, to do whatever it might be.
Sarah: [00:05:24] Well, and why we really wanted that expertise and wisdom here originally, before we trapped you into celebrating the last episode is, with the pandemic, where do you feel like that has really helped you? Because I mean, you know, I get in this space where even though, I, I feel like we really do live seasonally in my house.
I really, I mean, I always tell people, that's why I live in Kentucky cause I like seasons. I would, could never live at a place like Florida, California, where the weather never changes. I really love leaning into that. Although something tells me like botanist in Florida and California would say like, no, there are natural [00:06:00] changes going on. They just don't look like the hallmark card you're envisioning, but in a time, like the pandemic where there's so much struggle and so little margin, you know, some of the toughest moments I've had to remind myself like this is not forever. Like even still, you know, a silly thing right now, my dishwasher's broken.
It's been broken for four weeks and I get in the space where I'm like, this is going to be forever. And I have to like really channel my seasonal Sarah and say like, no, this is not forever. Your dishwasher will not be broken forever.
Sara Sterley: [00:06:27] Yes. So I think I'm thinking a lot about the COVID winter ahead, as I've been calling it. And I actually early in March just started calling it COVID season, you know. Like even, I think there's a lot of power in naming things to just like break off the shackles and the shooting and all of that, that we do to ourselves. So nobody's ever done a global pandemic before so calling it COVID season is like, of course you're, you know, like whatever you fill in the blank you're feeling today.
You've never done a global pandemic before. You know, [00:07:00] I think that there's a lot of, for me, there's been a lot of power in our house. I mean, so much so that that's become kind of like a mantra. If somebody's, you know, like for example, yesterday, I just was like super snappy at everybody. And, and I asked for forgiveness at the end of the day and you know, they kind of spouted off to me.
It's it's all right. It's COVID season because we've been saying it so much. So I think that that's helpful just to like offer ourselves grace and each other grace, because I think that if we look at it as an opportunity, I mean, and I'm not just, you know, broad brush, positive thinking kind of thing, but there, because it is to your point, it is going to be a rough few months ahead and winters is hard anyway.
But one thing that I've figured out or learned, I should say from living seasonally is that when I winter has Indiana, like you guys are not that far and Kentucky, it's like. It doesn't, it's not that, you know, if it snowed a lot, I'd probably, I would love [00:08:00] that. It's the gray days where it never gets above 40 and everything's just like muddy, mush for it seems like months, it's not.
And I just would get really down in the dumps about it. And so I, when I was able to see like, Oh, you need to find some ways to make winter special. So like for us, we have a wood-burning fireplace that's, you know, running like all winter long and we just that, it's like reading season, you know, like kind of books by the fire.
We keep some like christmas lights up on the mantle to keep things warmer. Um, so I'm trying to, I was trying to think of things that people could think ahead for COVID winter to incorporate, and it doesn't have to be anything, you know, I mean like expensive or like forcing yourself into anything. It could just be, because if you really think about it, if you have ways that you find pleasure or fun that are at your house, you know, with either just by yourself, [00:09:00] like reading or with your family, that's kind of a superpower for decades down the road, in terms of your budget, in terms of like your contentment contentedness with life.
And so like maybe, you know, you try some new family games together or like, Um, at the beginning of COVID, we did the whole Star Wars, you know, not whatever however many there are. Um, there, the kids are wanting to do Marvel, all the Marvel movies in order.
Sarah: [00:09:26] Yeah we did that in the spring, it was super fun.
Sara Sterley: [00:09:28] So like, something like that, you know, that isn't, it doesn't have to be this big elaborate thing, but setting it aside as something to look forward to. And so we said with the Marvel movies, like, we're not doing that until like the middle of January, because like we need something to look forward to for that stretch. Um, you know, some people like pipe, um, crafts, like knitting and I mean, I've tried to learn to knit like 19 times.
So I'm not the expert here. I'm just saying, like trying to brainstorm different ways or winter is a time in nature where, you [00:10:00] know, everything's at rest. So maybe you, you say your COVID winter is going to be like, I'm going to get better at rest. Yeah. I'm going to bed earlier or,
Sarah: [00:10:09] well, and I've also tried to really focus on, like, I think I had a narrative in my head that like, you don't go outside when it's cold and I've really tried to get over that.
Like now I'm really trying to, um, channel that sort of Nordic attitude of like, no, you just there's no bad weather, just bad clothing, right? Like you always go outside, you go outside, you take a couple of walks a day. I love Aaron Moon's stupid. You just take the stupid walk trademark. Cause it worked so good even though you, you know, it feels like it should be a beautiful sunny day and that's the only time you go outside, but it really does help to just get outside and see the changes.
I think, because there's something about being outside, even when you feel like it's just gray and mush that you go out enough and you start to notice, it's not actually just gray and mush. Things are happening and you start to look around and see the changes. Um, [00:11:00] and that, you know, it's not, everything's not dead and winter, it's just resting. And I think that really, like that helps my attitude too. Like realizing like that winter is a season of dormancy and rest, but that's because we're, we're saving energy for the next season. Like it's, it's a really, really important part of the process.
And I think we just have a narrative in America in particular that winter is just something to be survived as opposed to like a really essential part of the process. And I think with, you know, after this global pandemic, after this very intense season in American history, like that's not over yet, but like, as we see the light at the end of the tunnel with the vaccines, like we need rest, we need, I mean, I'm my word for 2021 is gentle.
Like I'm really trying to think through like, how can I be more gentle on myself? Honestly, that's part of the reason that, you know, we're ending the Nuanced Life, I think is because, you know, one more thing on the [00:12:00] list is just, it takes its toll. It takes its energy and it prevents that rest and energy retention and just that gentleness with yourself, as opposed to like the go, go, go, go, go we're all so used to that I think we've really seen what happens when the go go go is not possible. And I think like, hopefully we've all gained some clarity around. Breaking that American addiction to productivity and efficiency and doulas.
Sara Sterley: [00:12:27] I think another opportunity of COVID winter and just COVID season in general is I heard you both say, I think I'm pantsuit politics the other day that we just are waking up to how much we need to break up with the, the kind of cult of productivity and efficiency. And honestly, most of my therapy for the past couple of years has been just that, like how much worth I determined by what I do instead of who I am. And I think that even, even living this way or, you know, practicing it, I still have a long way to go.
But [00:13:00] winter teaches me that every year, like that the to-do list stays there, that it's good to take care of my body and, and to rest well and deeply and more, and not for, so like in one way that I've reframed it too, is. Yes. It's like a, both and yes for the, the more energetic seasons of spring and summer ahead.
And because I'm, it's good to take care of me all by itself like not for whatever I might do, you know, next season, but it's good to take care of me right, right here right now. And so that reframing has helped. Me. And I think like that's beautiful that, um, you're gentle for the, and I think that's really what we all need to adopt for, for at least COVID winter ahead is just that being gentle, especially starting with ourselves and then having that an out of that kind of talk with ourselves and we kind of fill up our own tank, then there might be some, you know, overflow on other people that gentleness, especially the people, you know, that we're all stuck in our [00:14:00] homes with. I
Beth: [00:14:01] am realizing about myself right now that I need that period of rest, but I also am very much like a child who's way past tired and so getting rest is harder. Because, you know, the frustrating thing about rest is that you rest better when you're well rested. And so trying to think about ways coming into winter, and I'm really using this Christmas as a springboard for this to invite myself like one step at a time into the kind of restoration that I need from COVID season.
The first thing, and this is so silly, but it's helping me a lot because I have felt really blue about Christmas this year in a way that I didn't expect. And so the first thing for me is deciding that I am not going to get out of my pajamas on Christmas day, which I've never done as an adult.
Cause we've always traveled and it's been like, get the presents open. Yay. Hooray. Now get in the car, everybody [00:15:00] and here we go and hours of driving. And so, I'm really just excited about having a day as an adult in my house on Christmas day in my pajamas and I feel like that's invitation number one. And then I'm trying to think of what's invitation number two, and how do I, the way that I would with a child, you know, cause an overtired child needs like all of that love and affection and tolerance for the short nap so that you can get back on track.
And, and that's what I'm thinking about for myself right now. I wonder if you are seeing that elsewhere too.
Sara Sterley: [00:15:34] I love that. I think too, just to like exactly how you painted that, Beth is how so there's point adopting, gentle as her word of the year. But I think a lot of us are like, well, how I don't even know how to. Uh, you know, it's, it's easy to do it with a small child or easier depending on the child, I guess. But, um, the, the way to do that is to think of yourself as a small child and like what [00:16:00] you might need. And so, like, that's the perfect gateway to think about COVID winter is like, what do you need? And how can you kind of strip away the things that you don't need?
And so there's so, I mean, you guys have talked about this. We, on the other side of this, there is going to be so much grief, whether we are awake to it or not. And so it's going to be me, we're all living through a traumatic event together. And so there's going to be much work to be done on the other side of it.
I don't know if you know, who has the self-awareness to do it. And I think rest is a big component of that, because if you're you just, if you're not well rested, nothing else functions well, and so kind of looking at it as part of your work to do this winter is just to be excessively gentle with yourself and get yourself the rest you need.
Tool I have in my toolbox is Yoga Nidra. Um, I just use, I, I prefer to practice yoga nidra by myself at my house. And, um, so [00:17:00] it's the yoga of sleep. It's kind of one of the oldest, um, yoga, meditation techniques. And you're really in a deep state of unconsciousness, but, um, most of us and I teach this once a month.
And honestly, in 2020, most of the times I've practiced, I fall asleep. So even because my body needs that and Americans are just like chronically under slept. So I see in most of the students, I teach that, you know, they fall asleep. That's great. That's what your body needed. Um, but it actually walks. There's a process that walks you through and scientifically they've studied it, studied it in functional MRI machines.
And the science is a little, I mean, they're, you know, a little fuzzy in terms of exactly how, how the two are correlated, but they use it a lot with PTSD and in the MRIs, they've shown that a like 40 minute session of, um, yoga nidra is equivalent to a four hour nap in terms of how restorative it is to your body.
[00:18:00] And so again, trying not to think of it like efficiency, you know, like, Oh, I can get a four hour nap, but just really topping off that sleep tank. Um, and that's one practice that I use a couple of times a week, um, just to especially more so in the winter, um, to kind of top off my tank, so to speak.
And I think that we all just even if, and this is something that you could look ahead with COVID winter. Maybe you're not, you know, a lot of us, but I don't know about you guys. Like my sleep has just been really weird in 2020 even if, you know, do all of the things. Like I have the weighted blanket and the dark out curtains and, you know, trying not to be on my phone before, like all the hygiene sleep hygiene, things they tell you to do, and it's still just off.
And so I think if we could go into just look at COVID winter as an opportunity to really, uh, be gentle with ourselves and get as much rest as we can in whatever ways that looks like and I recently [00:19:00] re-read Burnout. Have you guys read it?
Beth: [00:19:02] Yes. The Nagoski sisters.
Sarah: [00:19:04] Have you read Anne Helen Peterson's? You've got to read that too.
Sara Sterley: [00:19:07] Yes, I like wanted to throw it across the room several times.
Sarah: [00:19:12] So true. That's appropriate reaction to that book.
Sara Sterley: [00:19:14] I kept like the whole sections to my husband, like angrily on the couch. And he was like, I think maybe I should just read this book instead of, um, anyway, Burnout, what, you know, like I had read it a few years ago.
Things stick out and then I read it again. And I actually think this would be a really good, like 2021 book for every woman, but man too, for that matter to read, um, as we look on the other side of things and what that might, what we could imagine it to be. But one thing that stuck out to me this time when I re-read, it was, um, They talk about how many hours a day that you need of rest and they define rest, not as sleep.
So like, you know, connecting with your partner or something or your children, or, you know, a dog or something like that. Um, they [00:20:00] actually quantify like physical activity as rest because you're resetting your nervous system and things like that. Um,
Sarah: [00:20:07] It's almost like you need to tell Americans, you need a certain amount of not work time and that you need to not be working.
Sara Sterley: [00:20:14] Right. And not have your mind on it or not have your mind trying, you know, for me, like one thing that stuck out this time was like, you need to have time to think about food where that's all you're doing is being present, like with your food. Right. You know what? I'm cooking, I'm listening to a podcast or. Um, you know, whatever.
And so it's like, Oh, I just need to like pick one thing at a time because I'm not like really getting the full benefit of this by trying to multitask and stuff like that. So that stuck out to me that I, um, just need to, to be more kind of single-minded in order to get more of that restorative aspect of the things, you know, whatever it might be that I'm doing and that there's.
To Sarah's point, like I just need to set aside a lot more time than I do where I'm just, I'm not working. And, and [00:21:00] I think that, that, I think really the invitation of 2020 is to figure out ways that we can break up with that productivity culture. I mean, I don't think it, I think it's probably the work of the rest of my life for sure um, because it has deep roots.
Sarah: [00:21:17] You know, I think I've intellectualized so many of those lessons. Like I, I know intellectually that I need sleep and that I, you know, I know intellectually that I need to, you know, like dial up my stress management when the stress gets, cause for a long time, the lesson I had to learn over the last few years is like, well, I have good stress management.
I do yoga. I meditate, I journal. And so I should be able to manage all stress. And I had to learn like, no, if the stress gets higher in intensity, then you have to spend more time managing it. I mean, there was a time, [00:22:00] I'm not doing it anymore, but like definitely in November, in October I was taking a daily nap because my blood pressure was going up and my anxiety was at like, really really intense levels.
And I just had to, like, my body was like, I am, because I think I, I intellectualize so much. And so then what I'm really doing is storing it in my body, like so many of us. And I think, you know, what I'm really trying to, to practice is that like rest is not intellectual thought either. You know, like it's not thinking about rest thinking is not rest, right?
Like learning lessons about rest, reading articles about rest, is not rest. And that's really hard for me because I, you know, I, I told him my therapist the other day, I think there's a part of me that, that holds this narrative that like the only time I, the only thing that is actual stress is like trauma.
Like that's the only thing that I [00:23:00] intellectualize as stress is like really intense trauma or grief, because I think that in parts, because that was what I was introduced to as a young person, like with the school shooting, like that's what I learned was like, that was like the first time I felt real, like something that I could intellectualize as something very difficult.
And so in my mind, like, well, stress is difficult so the only thing that's like really difficult you can complain about is like hardcore trauma, which is not true, obviously. And so realizing that, like that, I try to view everything that I'm experiencing through this intellectual thought process, instead of feeling it in my body.
My body's like just going to keep dialing it up until it gets my attention, either through anxiety or blood pressure, or like, how am I sleeping and rest? I think you're 100%, right? Like a couple of like probably a year ago or so ago. I thought, well, I don't feel tired during the day. I'm going to see if I could sleep less.
[00:24:00] And so I started, I went from like probably eight hours of sleep to like six and a half and seven. And I didn't, it's not like I was like passing out from exhaustion, I guess, intellectually that's the only the only thing I thought would like be like it's not working until I realized that like I will, I was getting crazy headaches, crazy tension.
I think my blood pressure was probably up and I thought, Oh, Oh, wait a second. Oh, that's like, it's just so funny. I think in the ways in which we intellectualize what this will look like instead of just listening to how we feel. I think that's what I do a lot. Like I tell my, I tell myself a story instead of just listening to my body.
And so my body just gets louder and louder and louder. And I think that happened a couple of times with COVID. Um, I think I had the first panic attack of my life in this, in the early spring with like, where I was like, Oh, this is what this is what's happening right now until my body was like, listen, like girl, you're going to listen to me one way or the other.
It's like I told my friend the other day, She's having all [00:25:00] these troubles with her hormones and I'm, and I'm like, I think you need to stop drinking caffeine. And she's like, Oh my God. And I'm like, listen, the truth is the hormones are gonna win. Like they go in a win one way or the other, like they, you can not battle them into submission.
It's not how it works. And like, I think just the, this COVID season, because everything is so intense and because the manifestations of anxiety and stress, particularly with the like sort of racial reckoning and the election and all these things taught, our kids being home, was just like one time after the other of my body like, you have to listen to me, like you have to.
Like, there is more going on here than your intellectual thought process, like there's way more to the story than that. And I think like, Plugging into nature and like grounding myself in the seasons in the passage of time, instead of my narrative of control over my life is like, that's when I'm in such a healthier space with regards to my attitudes surrounding that.
Sara Sterley: [00:25:54] I mean some of this, you know, this is where I think the Enneagram is helpful because so I'm a [00:26:00] seven so I spent too much time in my head too, Sarah, and it's hard for me to get into my body. But whereas like some, um, like the gut triad that they, those people have, it's easier for them to get in touch with their what's going on in their bodies.
Um, but I also think it just, this is an American culture thing too, where it's like, what doesn't kill you makes you stronger. But it's like, what? Doesn't kill you, just kills you. You know, like that's not, it it's just a bad mentality. Poisonous really. Because our body is, it keeps the score as the book says and so like, we have to pay attention.
And I think too, it's like peeling an onion almost or something, you know, I don't know if you all have noticed this, but especially with a practice like yoga where, you know, you're with your body and matching your movement with your breath, that the more you practice, that the more like finely tuned that instrument becomes.
And so where you used to supposedly be [00:27:00] able to power through. I mean, some of this is age too, I think, but, um, now you're just more awake to those kinds of subtle or not so subtle nudges then maybe you used to be, and that's kind of a relearning too, of, you know, at that, Oh, I need to listen or else, you know, like to Sarah's point that what, you know, what might happen if I, if I'm not paying attention.
And so the more you do that, the more your body kind of trusts you to listen to it. And so you, you can hear it more if that makes sense. Um, and so I think that it's one of those things that the more you just like anything, I guess, but the more you practice, um, the more aware you get. So I think for a lot of us, myself included, like I was always especially practicing yoga for a long time and not really just like staying in my head with it.
Um, And then being able to, to, to kind of like drop in to my body and realizing how much stuff I wasn't listening to. Um, [00:28:00] but we, that just comes with practice and I think it's really individualized in how that works for you. I just think that it's really important that we do it because it's just to like live up here, um, and intellectualize things.
And, you know, for me, like I'll research something instead of just like actually doing it. Um, and so I think that that's where we can just kind of, uh, surrender to the wisdom of, you know, all of our ancient traditions and, and be like nature and, and rest, um, especially in the winter. And I just think we're going to need it.
I mean, COVID like the global pandemic by itself, like would be enough grief, you know, but then the, just the, the leadership failures and, um, just kind of like, uh, I think for me had a lot of grief around how poorly we've just bungled this whole thing. And then, so that alone would be enough. And then like the racial reckoning [00:29:00] and kind of, um, and just like how different we feel about these things, you know, like, especially um, Christians, you know, like that are anti maskers. That just feels like a strange, like, I just don't understand it, you know, like, so there's just all these different layers of things to grieve from this year.
And we can't, we have to be well rested in order to be able to confront those things. And if we don't confront them, then they will show up in disastrous ways down the road for ourselves and our loved ones. And so we want to be able to deal with these things as they come up and feel them release them. And we can't do that if we're just like exhausted and just kind of on autopilot, you know?
[00:30:00] Beth: [00:30:02] I want to linger on your point about how it takes a while to get out of your head and into your body and yoga, because I think that applies to almost every practice of rest. You know, anytime I'm having a conversation like this with Sarah, I remember myself like 10 years ago and how I would have been unable to hear this conversation and would have like rolled my eyes at a lot of it.
And it would have thought like that does not work for me. I am not that person. And I think what I've learned is that. You have to learn how to do everything. You have to learn how to get a good massage. Like if you go the first time and say it didn't provide me any relief. Well, of course it didn't. It was the first time.
You have, your body hasn't learned how to respond to a massage yet. Or hasn't, hasn't learned how to respond to a massage with this practitioner yet because every practitioner is so different. I think therapy is the same way. If you go three times and decide it's not working for you. Like you haven't had a chance to learn how to do [00:31:00] therapy yet.
And I think a lot of forms of, of rest really require discipline in order to reap any benefits. And it's hard to prioritize that, but I also think that there's an invitation in that because that's where it does link up with our, you know, productivity is a weakness of ours for sure.
But if we can find the strength in it, it's in saying, okay, I'm going to dedicate myself to rest for a while and not that I'm going to hack it, but then I'm going to be consistent in that practice. I'm going to think of my rest practice, the way I would think of piano lessons or something and keep coming back, even when it feels like I'm failing at it, because it's the time and the commitment that gets you there.
Sara Sterley: [00:31:46] I love that. That's so well said. And I think that that's just kind of adulting, you know, over and over, like to your point, it's like we just have to keep practicing these things. And I think one thing that living [00:32:00] this way has me be grudgingly, um, is that on the other side of discipline is freedom. And so like when I, you know, discipline, um, because of our values of living seasonally and, um, kind of lightly on the earth and we don't, you know, eat certain foods unless they're in season that it seems like a restriction in the time.
But on the other side of that is like such enjoyment of that food that's in season and the looking forward to it the rest of the year. I mean, that's like a small example, but it's just nature shows me over and over again that on the other side of that discipline is, is more freedom, those kinds of guard rails.
And so the discipline of rest actually, you know, makes me a better human and more of who I'm supposed to be. Like I can show up as who I'm supposed to be more. Um, you know, confidently and, uh, [00:33:00] contentedly, you know, like in, in the present, if that makes sense. Um, but I think, yeah, we have to dedicate ourselves to it and find what works for us.
Um, because just like anything else where every body is literally different. And so what works for somebody else. I like to say it's like, we're all in our own experiments, you know? And so we have to try out these different things on ourselves because what works for Beth might not work for me. Um, but it's worth trying out and, and trying out in a way that isn't just like trying it once to test point.
You know, you have to kind of like give it a few weeks to see whattactually works. And so looking at like these individual experiments that we have to test things out on is helpful because you wouldn't just try something once in a lab. I mean, I'm not a scientist, but I don't think that's how and so, so you would have to try it several times.
Sarah: [00:33:51] Well, and I, you know, what I hope what COVID season has taught us and, you know, still has the ability to continue to teach us because, you know, COVID, season's not [00:34:00] over, 2020 is coming to an end quickly, but COVID season is not over. Like, I hope it teaches us a deeper appreciation because it has, there's been that process of withholding, you know, which we don't have a lot of experience with as Americans.
But we've been living with a lot of sacrifice and a lot of withholding. And I think that once we can social gather again, it will be even sweeter. And I hope that we don't, you know, take, makes me tear up. I hope we don't take it for granted again. And I think, you know, I think that some of that's inevitable, but I do think that what you're seeing is, you know, lots and lots of people learning that what they thought was key to their happiness was not, and what they took for granted as just a part of everyday life and not that important was incredibly important to their happiness.
And I think, you know, even I've learned that and I think that taking the lessons from seasons, you know, there's the seasons that come right back around, right? There's the seasons of nature that have winter and spring and summer and fall [00:35:00] that we get to experience again. But there are those seasons that are, you know, permanent, and then don't come around again, either seasons of hardship that, um, we learned from or seasons of goodness and celebrations.
I love newborns. You know, I love them so much. I would have 11 kids if it was really just, if we could go from newborns to early elementary, you know, and I think so much of what's so precious about them is that it's such a teeny tiny little phase. Um, and it goes so quickly.
And so I think, you know, appreciating the impermanence of things is. What seasons can teach us too, because you know, some, some seasons come back around, but some don't and you know, that that's even sort of what I think what we're experiencing with the Nuanced Life. Like, I think realizing like, Hey, just because we start this content, just because we start this process, and especially in the face of people enjoying it, because that's, what's hard, right?
Is some people [00:36:00] really, really love the Nuanced Life and it is hard to say like, well, it feels like in the internet, if somebody, if some people love something that should continue forever. And that's just not true either. You know, I think that there's so much, and I think it's kind of been fascinating to watch this.
I think we're not the only people experiencing this and like using the COVID season to reevaluate stuff. This really interesting thing on Instagram right now where all these Instagram influencers are like, I'm not going to do sponsored campaigns anymore. I'm done. I'm moving on because there's a sense of like, well, if it's, if people like it, if you make money off of it, that's a state of being not a season.
I think you definitely see that in this space. And so saying like no it's good and some people like it and it makes money and still, it's not meant to be here forever, in the internet space and the content space is like a whole other ball game.
Sara Sterley: [00:36:50] And I, I think too, that's a way that we break up with that productivity too, is by saying, you know, this isn't sustainable for, for you and [00:37:00] Beth anymore um, and your team. Um, and so, and that, it doesn't, it also means that like, it makes no judgment about the Nuanced Life, either. Like it, it was a season and it, it was wonderful while it lasted. You know, like, just because you are ending something, it doesn't have any judgment, I think on the quality of the work that you produced.
And, but that kind of consumeristic, it would be, you know, like judging it based on how much money it made or if you know, why would you quit if people still like it? And you guys are human beings, not human doings. And so you're as, as father Richie would say, and that's what we call them in our house. But, um, the, so I think that that's a really beautiful example for your listener.
You know, it's celebrating all things, but also knowing when it's, when it's time to put something to bed is something we could all learn, you know, lessons on better and doing it and [00:38:00] in a good way and good timing and things like that so.
Beth: [00:38:03] I think it probably something that the Germans have a word for that we don't, but just that sense of like, it just feels finished. I really respect. I'm sad that there are no more Schitt's Creeks being made, but I really respect that they were like, just feels finished. It feels like we did what we came to do. We did it as well as we could, and it's time to move on and that's not a failure. That's not sad in particular, you know, it's bittersweet because everybody misses the process, but that's how I feel about ending the Nuanced Life.
Um, it's how I feel about leaving 2020 in a lot of ways. Um, I definitely feels finished 2020 does to me. Um, I'm wondering as we wrap up and we think about what's next, how you're thinking about what happens after COVID season.
Sara Sterley: [00:38:51] Well, I think that it's been an invitation for all of us to think about, like Sarah was saying all those things [00:39:00] anted, like what we really miss for one and for two, what are those things or rhythms ,um, habits, whatever that might be, that we don't want to run back to. That have been good and now it's time to let go of. You know, like some of those things that we just did because we just got kind of sucked into habitually doing them, instead of really thinking with intention. Um, for us, we just have really, you know, pared down our calendar even more.
And obviously because we're, you know, not doing much, but it's been nice and I we've really needed it from an energy standpoint. We just haven't had, you know, the, kind of the, the stamina that we did pre COVID. And so I, I don't see us like running back to a lot of that stuff unless we feel like really conscientiously ready for it.
And so I think that's the invitation, I think too, this is a really good year to, so the most of our agrarian cultures [00:40:00] celebrated the spring Equinox as the new year. Not the january 1st on the Gregorian calendar. And you know, like January 1st is a really terrible time, technically for most of us and most of the Northern hemisphere to be setting resolutions and like doing all of the things that we tend to do on January 1st, it's dark, it's dreary.
Uh, it's just, nature is not supporting us in that new energy, but in the spring, nature supports us like there, you know, life is bursting forth. And so we, for our family, we started like January 1st is, and if you like the clean slate of that, like you do, you obviously, but I think it's an invitation to just look at the winter as the winter.
It's a time for rest and restoration and, um, kind of getting ourselves in the best, um, you know, filling our tanks as best we can for whatever is ahead and then looking at maybe the spring. I mean, depending on the vaccine situation, as kind of that new year and fresh start [00:41:00] so that you're not expecting everything to be different on January 1st, 2021.
Cause it's not going to be, it's probably going to be darker and worse for awhile after that, you know? So just like setting yourself up for success that maybe this winter is just about taking care of yourself, being like we said, excessively gentle with yourself and your people hunkering down. Maybe finding a few new things.
I think too. It might be a good idea to like, think about what, what you do for fun and pleasure that is just at your house. Like for me, I, 2020 has been like really cheesy romance novels. I just, I, I, it's the only thing that I can do to like escape. And I've just been, you know, like reading romance, novels for fun and not like worrying about productivity, you know, like I'm not learning anything for most of these books. Um, but they're enjoyable and I like it. And so like that, that might be a good idea. Just to look for something that, again, this could be a superpower down the road. If you find you discover, you [00:42:00] know, maybe it's knitting or whatever, baking, you know, whatever it might be.
It doesn't have to be producing anything. That's what I like about the romance novel thing is it's just, it's just fun for me. And so I think looking at this winter is just a way to, to really practice over and over again, rest and figuring out what works for you. Maybe finding something that you or your family do for fun, that is just at home, you know, getting outside more, hiking, more, whatever, fill in the blank for you trying out different things.
And then looking more like at the spring as that kind of fresh start, um, versus January. Yeah. First, because I just think that we're kind of setting ourselves up for. Disappointment. If we expect things to be a whole lot different in January, 2021.
Sarah: [00:42:45] Yeah.
Beth: [00:42:46] As someone new to the romance novel set. Here's what I am finding. I think, because I kind of read them for a while and then got very far away from them for like this 10 year hiatus, and then here I am, again. [00:43:00] Here's my hypothesis. I think it might be that romance novels, like a lot of things make your relationship more of what it is.
I think when I was in a really bad relationship, reading romance novels reminded me of how bad it was. And now I think that I have this happy marriage reading romance novels makes me even happier about my happy marriage. So that's my theory, just a little detour theory, but I love that thought of nature, supporting whatever season you're in and kind of makes me feel better about being so blue right now, because nature is definitely supporting my blueness right now. And, um, I'm looking forward to nature supporting something else.
Sara Sterley: [00:43:37] Yeah. And I think too, one thing I think about a lot is just that analogy of, you know, nature doesn't even, even in California, the plants don't bloom perpetually. And so we cannot be just like in the. For us blooming looks like productivity and you know, doing things and it's like, we it's, it's not natural.
There will be consequences to us, just [00:44:00] continually thinking that we have to be in this state of bloom all the time. And so we really need those inward seasons of fall and winter to kind of regroup, reflect like surrender what needs to be, let go of, um, rest a time and, and just do that because it's the right, you know, like that's how we care for ourselves.
Um, just like we would, you know, the garden that we put to bed and then in the spring and summer, if you're feeling it, you can lean into some of those more, you know, the, the energy of the season and you know, doing more perhaps if that works for you. And that looks differently for everybody based on what season they're in.
Sarah: [00:44:37] Well, here we are coming to the end of another season for us at the Nuanced Life. Sarah, thank you so much for joining us. We are so grateful for you as a guest. We're grateful for your, you as a listener. We're grateful for all of our listeners who have come along on this journey with us over the last four years.
I can't believe it's been four years. We've had some [00:45:00] incredible conversations. It has been such a privilege and an honor to be invited into all of your lives, to commemorate things, big, small, sad, happy. I've learned so much about all of you. I've learned more about myself and I've definitely gained a deeper appreciation for all the aspects of this nuanced life we're all living.
Beth: [00:45:17] So please don't let the end of the Nuanced Life Podcast stop you from sending us your commemorations or advice questions, or whatever else you might have sent us because as Sarah said, we are going to be exploring those ideas in other formats, and we can't wait to share it with you.
Also, if you are not a Pantsuit Politics listener, please join us for 2021. Politics is going to be a very different space in then just a few weeks, I think, and we're really excited about that. We're excited about our last segment of that show, where we talk about what's on our minds outside of politics, you will start to hear some very nuanced life kind of content there.
So we hope that you'll join us. We hope that this has been a supportive conversation, as you think about the season that you're in, and we hope that you have the very best [00:46:00] winter available to you. And thank you so much for having been on this journey with us.
Sarah: [00:46:18] The Nuanced Life is produced by Studio D Podcast Production.
Beth: [00:46:22] Alise Napp is our managing director.
Sarah: [00:46:24] Dante Lima is the composer and performer of our theme music.
Beth: [00:46:28] Learn more about our work by visiting PantsuitPoliticsShow.com to sign up for our weekly newsletter and following Pantsuit Politics on Instagram.